Please understand that I do not tell anyone that they have to tithe. BUT - - - - - - - - - -

Whether you tithe or not is strictly between you and God.

I will tell you that the giving of a tithe started long before Moses came along, and long before the Mosaic Law was given.


This is Abram (later named Abraham) who gave a tithe to Melchizedek, ( a priest of the Most High God.) who was king of Salem (later called Jerusalem). And this was long before the time of Moses, by more than four hundreds of years. Before Abram ever had a child.

When Moses brought the people out of Egypt, it was not until the Tabernacle was built that the Lord commanded the people to bring in a tithe INTO the Tabernacle for the support of the Priest, and out of that tithe, the Priest were commanded to give a tithe of whatever they received.

In the New Testament, Jesus has something to say about the giving of a tithe.


As I read it, while the pharisees were paying their tithe, they had No Justice, No mercy, and No faith. Jesus told them that they should have been giving Justice, giving mercy, and having faith, while at the same time continuing to give a tithe.

I see nothing in the New Testament to put an end to the giving of a tithe, for as I show above, the tithe was instituted long before the Mosaic Law. And Was reinforced within the Mosaic Law, and by Jesus, in the New Testament, showed that the tithe should continue. It is to be continued for the support of the House of God.

The following, In the Book of Malachi, shows what God has directly said about the giving of a tithe.

___________________________

Now I will repeat that I will not tell anyone that they Must give a tithe. For that is directly between you and God.

What I will do is to tell you a little true story of what happened to me when I started paying a tithe to the Lord's Church.

I had just retired in the middle of Feb of 1989 from a job that was paying me about $880 a week, on 40 hours plus $175 double time for working on Sundays (required), for a total of close to $1100 a week before taxes. I went from that $1100 a week to a pension of $100 a week. No other income, no savings. Of course we had many bills for I was forced out at age 55 by a company that went into bankruptcy. I got out 3 days before my union went on strike, and 9 days before my company went into bankruptcy. I was fortunate in that I received any pension at all. I was fortunate that my house was paid off, free and clear. But even so, I had to take another job at minumn wage, and my wife had to take a job at minumn wage just to pay the bills and to eat. And coming up on us was tax time where I had to pay taxes on what I had made the year before, taxes on that high pay that I had received.

It was then that I told my wife in March that we had to start giving a tithe to the church. As I let her keep the books, she instantly went ballistic. She showed me the books that even with everything we had in the bank, and with all of my pension, and with every cent that both she, and I, could make between then and tax time, that we would not be able to pay our taxes that year.

Well it ended up that we did start giving a tithe to the church early that March of 1989, 10% of all that we had coming in. And you know what? On the day that we filed out taxes, we not only had enough to pay the taxes, but we had money left over. Neither of us knew where it came from, but it was there.

Since that time, there has never been a time when we did not have what we needed. The money we needed always showed up at the last minutes to pay for whatever it was that we had to pay for, like a repair on the car, a trip out of state for a funeral, or some such thing. I do not say that the money was all free, although on rare occasion there just appeared in our checking account the extra money we needed. There were times when I suddenly has a whole lot of overtime pay, or credit which had been denied was suddenly approved. Or a few times I would receive a check in the mail for My Ministry from someone.

When you hold back your tithe, you are relying on yourself. When you give of your tithe even when you are sure that you just cannot afford to pay it, then you are trusting and relying on God to take care of you. And God Will take care of you.

I am not saying that God will give you every desire of your heart, but He will provide what you need. And that need may not be in the lavish style that you have been living, and desire, but will be in a style by which you can live. Believe me when I tell you that I and my wife came down a very long way from the living style that we had been living. But we are comfortable, and neither of us has any worry of what tomorrow will bring, for we know that the Lord God is taking care of us.

We watched a man in our church who had been paying a tithe of $125 a month, tell us that he just could not afford to pay it that month. Within a week his truck broke down and it cost him exactly $125 to have it fixed. The Lord would not let him keep that money, but took it from him one way or another. And I only point out what happened in this one case, I do not mean to imply that it will happen to you that way. For the Lord treats each of us differently, fairly, but differently.

I did note in the bible that if a man was not able to pay his tithe when it was due, that the Lord would allow him to pay it later, but at an increase, instead of the 10% tithe, the man was then required to pay double that or 20% when he did pay it.

I hope that this will clear the air about the tithe business.

I must also make note here of the difference of the giving of the tithe and the giving of a donation. All donations are in addition to the tithe, and not a replacement for the tithe. The tithe must be brought into the House of the Lord for the support of the House of the Lord, but a donation can be spent for the work of the Lord in any way that you choose to spend it. Example: you cannot go out and buy supplys for the Sunday school, or flowers for the church, and then call it part of your tithe, for it is not, it would be a donation, for you did not bring it into the House of the Lord for the upkeep of the House of the Lord.

I ask myself, when the Lord pulls me out of the organized churches as He has told me He will, where will my tithe go them?? I will have to wait for the Lord to tell me at that time, For I will continue giving a tithe on my increase for as long as I live on this earth.

1140. Vision and Prophecy given to Raymond Aguilera on 28 December 1997 at 7:28 AM.

The Lord showed me a Christmas tree and said, "even though this Christmas tree is nailed onto a wooden cross. It is like the body of Christ, "the church of man". It has no roots".

Prophecy:
The church of man asks you to give ten percent because it said in the Bible, that Abram gave to Melchizedek ten percent, but I tell you giving is GOOD! They are going to love hearing that, but I am also going to tell you. Giving is also like the little widow who gave the two coins. And giving is like Sapphira. It is going to be everything in the middle. (in-between) (over)
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391. Occurrence, Vision, given to Raymond Aguilera on 23 December 1993 at 8:25 PM.
Occurrence
During prayer, in the evening church service, the pastor was giving his sermon and every other word that was coming out of his mouth was about tithing, tithing, tithing, money, money, and more money. What I was hearing was really bothering me, as if what he was saying was hurting my spirit physically. He sounded as if he was possessed and was taking advantage of the church members during the Christmas season.

I prayed to the Lord for forgiveness if this resentment was coming from my flesh for this was grieving my spirit. During this prayer I started to repent for everything else since the pain was so strong. Then I was given a vision.

Vision
Then a vision of a large tongue appeared in the spirit. The next thing I see is the tail of a Lion sweeping this large tongue. Then the image stopped.

Vision
The next image I see is of an astronomer's observatory with a telescope and as I watch, it split right down the middle and a large White lit Candle came out from within the center of the building, and the same size as the observatory building. This was a very strong and vivid vision. Then it stopped.

In this pain, that I felt in my spirit about the pastors words, I could sense in the spirit the Lord's Tears coming from His Eyes as He listened to the pastor's words asking for money, money, and more money.

During this I didn't know why I sensed this pain, that's why I started repenting, in case it was something I was doing in the flesh. So I just repented everything I could think of, trying to protect myself in case it was my flesh. But in the heart of my spirit I knew that it was the Lord crying for what was being said by the pastor.
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2 Peter 3.15-16

And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

Amen.

i left the organized church a few years back,so when i have any extra money i send it to ray ,but being on disability it's not very often,but we have been helping little children in need for the last 5 years,buying for them even when i should pay bills ,for these children that have nothing are very great to god and i know he loves children ,so i pray that helping these children is the same as titheing and god always come thru when the money situation is weighing on us,my daughters car broke down and had to be towed needed 2,000$ to have it fixed and needed it in 2 days in one day out of the blue a lady that knew what happened sent my mother a card with 2,000$ in it for my daughter for her car ,and asked my mother not to say where it came from(we know it was from god),so rev. barr do you think helping out less fortunate people is the same as titheing?at least i know it's going to people who need it

Oh My brother,

I most assuredly do agree with you and these Prophecies.

It is not enough to give just a tithe if we can give more. As the prophecy says, the little widow gave all that she had, she did not hold back for some imagined tomorrow. She put her total trust in the Lord.

As for the preacher who could only preach money, money, money, tithe, tithe, tithe, there is Greed there. Again it is Man grabbing all that he can. I have sat in some sermons just like that one, and I knew that that preacher was NOT of the Lord, and never went back.

The Lord does not have to keep telling His people to give. The Lord will provide all that is needed. The Lord will see to it that there will be enough Tithes to run any church which belongs to Him, without the pastor begging for more money.

Dan Fineman is a prophet of God on par with Raymond Aguilera, and he lives in Puerto Rico.

I downloaded his book, 'The Book Called "NINE", (nine, of course, being the number of judgment.

He had a section that God said that tithing was done away with on the cross.

The only thing left in our Age is giving.

Of course, put all things before the LORD to see what is Truth.

God Bless You All,
BlueRiverTributaries

BlueRiverTributaries wrote:


Well Blue River,

Where, oh where, can you find in the Bible where it tells you that the giving of a tithe has been done away with by Jesus hanging on the cross????? Since the Tithe was instituted long before the Mosaic Law, and is supported by Jesus in the New Testament, the claim that it is done away with because it was part of the Mosaic Law doesn't hold water, for it was God who instituted the Tithe, and was not done by man.

I again give you


Let me ask, Does God still have houses?? Are the houses of God now called Churches??? Are not God's houses the Storehouse of God???

A whole chapter you say, it took that much to try selling that lie. He sure must have been trying to justify himself.

I even showed you where Jesus himself said that they should continue tithing, In the New Testament. And if you search the New testament you will see how the Christians supported the church with tithings as well as gifts of donations.

With what you have just told us about this man "Dan Fineman" and his book, I will tell you that you are wrong in placing him as a Prophet of the Lord God on a Par with Raymond Aguilera, for by what he is teaching, He is NOT even a Prophet of the Lord God. For he denies the Bible to justify himself.

Much pastors ask for tithe for "grow up" his curches...

But:

From: Vision and prophecy 850

Then later, the Lord said, "You're out of time. Don't build Me anymore churches."

Quite true, servant. Amen.

Hebrews 7

1 For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him;
2 To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all; first being by interpretation King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace;
3 Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually.
4 Now consider how great this man was, unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils.
5 And verily they that are of the sons of Levi, who receive the office of the priesthood, have a commandment to take tithes of the people according to the law, that is, of their brethren, though they come out of the loins of Abraham:
6 But he whose descent is not counted from them received tithes of Abraham, and blessed him that had the promises.
7 And without all contradiction the less is blessed of the better.
8 And here men that die receive tithes; but there he receiveth them, of whom it is witnessed that he liveth.
9 And as I may so say, Levi also, who receiveth tithes, payed tithes in Abraham.
10 For he was yet in the loins of his father, when Melchisedec met him.
11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?
12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.
13 For he of whom these things are spoken pertaineth to another tribe, of which no man gave attendance at the altar.
14 For it is evident that our Lord sprang out of Juda; of which tribe Moses spake nothing concerning priesthood.
15 And it is yet far more evident: for that after the similitude of Melchisedec there ariseth another priest,
16 Who is made, not after the law of a carnal commandment, but after the power of an endless life.
17 For he testifieth, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec. (Psa 110:4)
18 For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.
19 For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.
20 And inasmuch as not without an oath he was made priest:
21 (For those priests were made without an oath; but this with an oath by him that said unto him, The Lord sware and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec:) (Psa 110:4 )
22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.
23 And they truly were many priests, because they were not suffered to continue by reason of death:
24 But this man, because he continueth ever, hath an unchangeable priesthood.
25 Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them.
26 For such an high priest became us, who is holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and made higher than the heavens;
27 Who needeth not daily, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifice, first for his own sins, and then for the people's: for this he did once, when he offered up himself.
28 For the law maketh men high priests which have infirmity; but the word of the oath, which was since the law, maketh the Son, who is consecrated for evermore.
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Galatians 3.10-14
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.
13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
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2 Corinthians 9.7
Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.
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1609. Prophecy given to Raymond Aguilera on 6 April 2001 at 10:15 PM.

During prayer the Lord said, "For everything that happens under the Son (Jesus Christ), there is a reason."

godsword, you have helped me greatly in my Walk with Christ.

But I must disagree with you about tithing. For me, it makes much more sense that it was done away with on the Cross.

So I give you an excerpt of the Book Called NINE, written by Dan Fineman. I won't say whether he is a prophet or not.

I took Dan Fineman's Book to the Father and asked Him, and He said to me Fineman was a fine man.

The LORD has instructed me to write down the tithing section from Dan Fineman's Book, to you, godsword, and to all.

I have added the KJV, but both I and godsword know why.

May Only Truth prevail.


excerpt: (pages 182-185)

The Doctrine of tithing and prosperity

It was only a short while ago when in prayer I suddenly felt incredibly grieved in the Spirit. The Lord told me that this is how he feels about the doctrine of tithing. He said, "The doctrine of tithing is completely and utterly false." He then went on to add, "I nailed the requirement of the tithe to the Cross."

Colossians 2:14 (ESV) ...by canceling the record of debt that stood against us with its legal demands. This he set aside, nailing it to the cross.

(KJV: Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; )

Here is the quote above in context.

Colossians 2:8-15 (ESV) See to it that no one takes you captive by philosophy and empty deceit, according to human tradition, according to the elemental spirits of the world, and not according to Christ. [9] For in him the whole fullness of deity dwells bodily, [10] and you have been filled in him, who is the head of all rule and authority. [11] In him also you were circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, [12] having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead. [13] And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses, [14] by canceling the record of debt that stood against us with its legal demands. This he set aside, nailing it to the cross. [15] He disarmed the rulers and authorities and put them to open shame, by triumphing over them in him.

KJV: Col 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
Col 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
Col 2:10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:
Col 2:11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
Col 2:12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with [him] through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
Col 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
Col 2:14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
Col 2:15 [And] having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.

There is no instance in the New Testament where the tithe is mentioned. Giving is mentioned many times. God told me that I should teach and speak against the false doctrines of tithing and prosperity, and instead tech about the true doctrine of giving and provision.

The doctrine of giving

God wants us to give freely just as we were given freely by Christ. Does this mean that we should give only to ministries and ministers? No. We should help the poor and needy, and not turn aside from our own flesh. We should give to those who cannot pay us back. We should give cheerfully in our hearts, in secret, not expecting repayment. The tithe is fulfilled by the final sacrifice of Christ, but we are obligated to support and help each other out. In the early church, everyone gave freely to help out his brother and sister. Nevertheless, the Bible warns us not to support the idler.

The following is an excerpt from an earlier message posted on my website.

"My people must be free with their giving. You must also tell them that I am angry. I am angry. I am angry. Faith without works is dead. A man who turns his back on his own family has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever."(Both their natural family and their spiritual family)

Read Job 31. When Job defends himself before his friends he talks a lot about his giving.

Job 31:16-32 (ESV)
"If I have withheld anything that the poor desired,
or have caused the eyes of the widow to fail,
[17] or have eaten my morsel alone,
and the fatherless has not eaten of it
[18] (for from my youth the fatherless grew up with me as with a father,
and from my mother's womb I guided the widow),
[19] if I have seen anyone perish for lack of clothing,
or the needy without covering,
[20] if his body has not blessed me,
and if he was not warmed with the fleece of my sheep,
[21] if I have raised my hand against the fatherless,
because I saw my help in the gate,
[22] then let my shoulder blade fall from my shoulder,
and let my arm be broken from its socket.
[23] For I was in terror of calamity from God,
and I could not have faced his majesty.
[24] "If I have made gold my trust
or called fine gold my confidence,
[25] if I have rejoiced because my wealth was abundant
or because my hand had found much,
[26] if I have looked at the sun when it shone,
or the moon moving in splendor,
[27] and my heart has been secretly enticed,
and my mouth has kissed my hand,
[28] this also would be an iniquity to be punished by the judges,
for I would have been false to God above.
[29] "If I have rejoiced at the ruin of him who hated me,
or exulted when evil overtook him
[30] (I have not let my mouth sin by asking for his life with a curse),
[31] if the men of my tent have not said, 'Who if there that has not been filled with his meat?'
[32] (the sojourner has not lodged inthe street; I have opened my doors to the traveler),



Read Isaiah 58 on the true fast. There is a duality to this word. It teaches us how we should pray when we are fasting and why we should fast, but first it speaks of the true fast of God, which is to actually help others and give to them.

Isaiah 5:5-12 (ESV)

Is such the fast that I choose,
a day for a person to humble himself?
Is it to bow down his head like a reed,
and to spread sackcloth and ashes under him?
Will you call this a fast,
and a day acceptable to the Lord?



With the Love of Christ,
BlueRiverTributaries

Hi Brother Blue, and everyone else.

Like I said, I do not tell anyone that they need to tithe.

Like I said, that is an issue that is just between you and God Alone.

It is not if you believe what I said, it is if you believe what the Bible says, without the influence of any man, and that includes me.

I only hold up signs, it is up to each of you to determine if I hold up a sign from the Holy Lord God pointing the way, or if that other man over there who is holding up a sign pointing the opposite way is the one holding the sign from the Holy Lord God. For since we each point in different directions, only one of us can be pointing the way to the Holy Lord God's Will being done. It might be that Neither of us is holding a sign pointing to God's way, We might both be pointing Man's way. But at the best, since we point in different directions, only one can be pointing to God's way.

Do not do as I say, do not do as he says, do not do what they say, BUT do as the Holy Lord God Says, For the Holy Lord God has told us in His Word the Bible what He wants each of us to do.

If you believe that the Holy Word of God tells us to give of a tithe, then you had better tithe.

But if you Believe that the Holy Word of God tells us that we are not to tithe, then you had better not tithe.

But do not base your belief on what any man says, and that includes me, but Always base your belief on what the Bible says, trusting the Holy Spirit of God to show you the way.

The choice of belief is always ours. The choice of action is always ours. And the Consequnce of our belief, and actions, will always be ours alone. Be that Consequnce good for us, or be it bad for us.

You either look to God for direction, or you look to man for direction.

May the Holy Lord God Continue to Lead and Guide each and every one of you.

The_Servant wrote:

1414. Prophecy given to Raymond Aguilera 25 October 1999 at 2:45 PM.

The Lord said:
"When you give money to someone on the streets - Do you expect something back from Me?"
"When you give some money to people at church - Do you expect something back from Me?"
"When you help your neighbor - Do you expect something back from Me?"
"When you love someone - Do expect payment from Me?"
Look at your heart! Is there greed there or the Love of Jehovah, the Love of Jesus Christ, the Love of the Holy Spirit? (over)

Amen.

A too used verse of Bible:

Malachi 3.10
Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it.

Are you searching for blessings, or the Love of God: Jehovah - Jesus Christ - Holy Spirit?

I believe if it comes from the heart then its right. We do it without expecting anything in return. I believe God does it the same way. It comes from HIS Heart to us.